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March 27, 2011
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Recently bought a Monson .22 with 6" barrel. I get empty brass eject issues with certain types of ammo. Eley Pistol ammo is the worst. I have to use a cleaning rod to push them out. Bulk Remington ejects fine. CCI mini-mags are in between.
When I was looking a lot closer to the cylinder bores, I notice the bore finish is very rough from the "chamber" to the barrel end of the cylinder. Does anyone have spec's as to the desired dimensions and surface finish tolerances the cylinder would have coming from the factory?
If I try to hone the bores I'm afraid I might open them up too much and get into lead shaving/accuracy issues.
Any thoughts, experiences, suggestions & even snide remarks will be welcome....
August 29, 2009
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Dutchman - there were intermittent problems with rough cylinder bores on DW guns. Most of the guns reported with this problem are out of the Palmer factory but there have been reports of Monson guns as well. I had a Monson gun recently with chambers that looked like they were cut with a file - they were that bad. If you want to remedy the problem and have it done right, your best bet is to send the cylinder back to CZ and have it honed if it is salvageable. If it's not and they have open machine time they can probably make you a new one if it's worth it to put the additional investment into the gun. The alternative is to just live with the poor workmanship and shoot the ammo that gives you the least ejection problems.
Range Officer
Range Officers
Dans Club
March 27, 2009
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Dutchman, Welcome and sorry to hear problems with your Dan.You can try to polish (not hone) the cylinder, I have heard of folks using tooth paste to smooth things up. Also check to see if firing pin dent might be a problem, the owner previous to you may have dry fired it. Just my thoughts. Good luck and keep us updated.
Edit (on dry firing with rim fires, the dent caused by firing pin maybe slight though would hamper rounds from ejecting properly, I found this on an old single six and corrected with small round file and time. Not sure if the Dan's firing pin would reach cylinder though worth inspecting.)
September 26, 2010
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I have the same problem, I cleaned it well and problem didn't change. Midwest, please expand on the dry fire comment.
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January 24, 2009
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Just in case the basics have been overlooked...Dutchman, I assume you have thoroughly scrubbed the cylinder?
22's are a very sooty ammo from my experience & there could be old buildup in the cylinder bores from the previous owner, causing the spent cases to hang up in there.
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Range Officer
Range Officers
May 2, 2009
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I use a bronze bore brush chucked up in a drill and some very mild abrasive (tooth paste is good).
Try to stay in the rear of the cylinder, and leave the front as tight as posible.
SHOOT
March 27, 2011
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Gentlemen,
Thanks for the info/advice.
I have not spent a lot of time scrubbing the chambers yet. Did a quick clean, then to the range. Ya know ya just can't wait to shoot a beauty like this.
The plan forward is to do some serious scrubbing. I've got powder residue in the cylinder flutes that will not clean up. I've tried soaking with Kroil, Hoppes, Montana Extreme and all I get is a little smudge on the rag when I wipe it down. May have to soak this for a long time.
I figure the chambers also have this baked on reside.
I've got several different grits of diamond lapping compound as well as some Wheeler bore lapping compounds. I'm think'n a tight patch, some diamond paste and an electric drill might help to polish up the chamber a bit.
As for the rest of the "cylinder bore" I'm still decifer'n on how to handle that.
Another question for the DW guru's: What is the proper amount of cylinder endshake? and how is it reduced if found to be excessive? shim it like a Smith?
Regards
Range Officer
Range Officers
Dans Club
March 27, 2009
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I have never come across this problem so to keep it alive, I will pass it to others!
October 26, 2008
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Dutchman said:
Another question for the DW guru's: What is the proper amount of cylinder endshake? and how is it reduced if found to be excessive? shim it like a Smith?
Well I don't know if I'm a guru but I'll tell you what I use/do to fix those problems.
I have not been able to find information on specs directly from DW (never called the factory) however with the assumption that the designer of both DW and Colt's Mk 3 (trooper 3 and king cobra) used the same specs Kuhnhausen book (Colt DA rev. vol. 2) states .003 max cylinder endshake. Shims are not the correct way to fix cylinder endshake on DW's, I know it's been done but it's not technically correct. The cylinder collar would need to be stretched and then refit, it takes special tooling and a press.
Before you go out and have that done I would check YOKE/CRANE endshake and fix that before fixing cylinder endshake. I have noticed after doing……a couple (lost count) that the cylinder doesn't seem to take a bad beating but the crane lock (the piece that keeps the cylinder/crane in the frame) almost always is worn and needs to be replaced. Normally, replacing and refitting that to a relatively tight fit will take care of the endshake of both. I have a theory that the spring loaded ball bearing doesn't let the cylinder bash it's way around and cause wear. The crane lock I believe is designed and built to wear first, it is made of somewhat soft steel.
Hope this helps
superdan
March 27, 2011
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Superdan,
Thanks for the words of wisdom from the experienced.
As I strip the gun down and get into closer examination/cleaning of all the parts, I'll pay special attention to the yoke/crane interaction.
I'll let y'all know what I find.
I may be a few weeks before I get into it. Granddaughter's birthday, youngest son is buying a house, etc, etc.
Dutchman
December 28, 2010
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harly said:
Dutchman - there were intermittent problems with rough cylinder bores on DW guns.
Was this also in 15-2 .357's? I have a '79 model that gets pretty sticky shooting magnum loads. It's not the ammo. They eject fine in my other guns. I've scrubbed the jibbers out of the chambers & even ran a flared casing in & out. (My used M28 S&W came with a pretty good carbon ring too.)
Yeah. The chambers in mine look pretty rough.
December 28, 2010
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Wow. I really made a hash of the quote function. No idea how to edit it either. Sorry.
Range Officer
Range Officers
Dans Club
March 27, 2009
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Fishslayer said:
Wow. I really made a hash of the quote function. No idea how to edit it either. Sorry.
Happens to us all! Keep us posted on the fixer upper!
December 28, 2010
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Well... so far...
1. Various solvent & Kroil soaks & scrubbings. No help.
2. Flared case scraping. No help.
3. Drill motor & .40 bore brush. No help.
4. Drill motor & B-C Lead Remover polishing cloth. No help.
I'm almost convinced it's not a carbon ring. I'm also considering just using it with .38SP target loads & saving the Big Dog magnums for my more robust revolvers.
February 11, 2010
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Brush wrapped with #0000 steel wool on drill. Move up to #000 or #00
if no improvement with #0000. Trial and test time consuming but you
will get it.
-Blacktop
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Range Officers
May 2, 2009
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Fishslayer said:
I'm almost convinced it's not a carbon ring. I'm also considering just using it with .38SP target loads & saving the Big Dog magnums for my more robust revolvers.
What the hell is more robust than a DW
SHOOT
March 27, 2011
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Fishslayer, when you used the solvents, Kroil, brushes etc., did you keep getting black patches when you finished cleaning the chambers?
In other words is the carbon coming off very slowly, since it is so hard and "caked" onto the metal ?
Dutchman
September 26, 2010
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I solved my problem with ejecting .22s, maybe this will work for others. There was a very small ridge on the "entrance" side of the cylinders bore, I could not see it but could feel it with a dental pick. I used a cone shaped dremil stone with oil and gave each bore a low speed "countersinking" then ran a brush threw to remove any residue. I can't see a change but can feel the ridge is gone. I snowshoed out to the range (still two feet of snow here) and shot 100 round and they all ejected flawlessly. 
Before I had to hammer the spent brass out.
May 3, 2011
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SHOOTIST357 said:
I use a bronze bore brush chucked up in a drill and some very mild abrasive (tooth paste is good).
Try to stay in the rear of the cylinder, and leave the front as tight as posible.
SHOOT
I have used this same method too, even on barrel bores that really needed to be polished. Black powder guns sometimes have to be polished out if you don't clean them well enough. It helps polish them up.
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